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Impact investing barely overlaps with the NGOs delivering the SDGs. Laurie Lee ran CARE International UK and Gates Foundation Africa, and found two thirds of impact capital wants full market returns. This is TBLI Radical Truth with Robert Rubinstein. Lee went looking for the overlap between international NGOs and impact investors and found it far smaller than it should be. His case: roughly 15% of impact capital sits near capital preservation, and 15% of a trillion dollars is the size of the whole global aid budget. Fund the projects with a revenue stream from that, and aid goes where only aid can go. Laurie Lee was Chief Executive of CARE International UK for eight years. Before that he spent seven years at the Gates Foundation, three of them as Africa director, and served in the UK civil service and diplomatic service, including at DFID where he worked on the targets that became the Millennium Development Goals. WHAT'S COVERED - The Venn diagram problem: NGOs work on the SDGs every day, and almost none of that work reaches impact investors - What the GIIN numbers actually say: about two thirds of impact capital at market rate, 18% near market, 15% closer to capital preservation - Why CARE USA, World Vision and Mercy Corps Ventures have largely had to seed their own funds - Chipata in Lusaka: piped clean water for 600,000 people, funded with 10 million pounds, working 20 years later at roughly a pound per person per year - Why refuse collection kept failing until it was billed daily alongside the water, after which collection went from 5% to over 70% in weeks - Whether that project could have been funded with impact capital instead of aid, and what each side would have had to give - The myths finance tells about impact, and the ones it tells about itself - Fixing pharmacy stock-outs by making the supplier responsible for the shelf, and why that keeps people seeking care - Why people in poor countries already pay for water, in cash to unregulated sellers or in hours walked - Girls First Finance, founded by Andrea Pizziconi, and the market failure it targets: fee gaps, interest rate caps that keep private lenders out, and underwriting models that assume a young woman with no job is uncreditworthy CHAPTERS 00:00 Introduction, and meeting Laurie Lee 02:59 From DFID to the Millennium Development Goals 06:33 The Venn diagram: why NGOs and impact investors barely overlap 07:03 Was it the SDGs, or was it really just China? 08:41 The end of the Cold War, when aid stopped being a bribe 09:34 Why NGOs cannot speak the language of finance 11:06 The scoping study, and the answer CARE did not want 12:07 Two thirds of impact capital wants market rate returns 13:41 CARE USA, World Vision, Mercy Corps Ventures: largely self-funded 15:20 15% of a trillion dollars is the whole global aid budget 17:28 Chipata, Lusaka: clean water for 600,000 people at a pound a year 20:14 Why refuse collection failed until it was billed daily with the water 23:43 Could impact capital have funded that instead of aid? 27:00 The myths finance tells about impact, and about itself 30:03 Gates Foundation: grants versus programme related investments 33:21 Fixing pharmacy stock-outs, and why it keeps people seeking care 35:01 People do pay for water, in cash or in hours walked 40:10 Girls First Finance, and the market failure behind it 43:20 The interest rate caps that keep private lenders out of student loans 53:14 The private equity firm that colour-coded its portfolio by SDG ▶ Subscribe for a new Radical Truth conversation every week: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDBhRVM93uUnAAtqOMIz_yg?sub_confirmation=1 RELATED EPISODES - Kumar Garg, Renaissance Philanthropy, on building the fund layer philanthropy never built. - Rick Peck, The Philanthropy Guy, on why the overhead ratio tells you almost nothing. MORE ON LAURIE LEE - CARE International UK: https://www.careinternational.org.uk - Girls First Finance: https://girlsfirstfinance.com ABOUT THE TBLI RADICAL TRUTH PODCAST Welcome to the TBLI Radical Truth Podcast, where we feature the pioneers redefining the purpose of capital. For 30 years, TBLI Group has been the world's leading ESG and impact investing network. Here's why Radical Truth is different: most finance podcasts protect the industry — Radical Truth interrogates it. Every week, unfiltered conversations with the founders, fund managers and system-changers actually moving capital toward a liveable future, and calling out the impact-washing that isn't. No sponsors. No pretending. TBLI GROUP - https://www.tbligroup.com - Robert Rubinstein on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/robertrubinstein/ #ImpactInvesting #SDGs #BlendedFinance #InternationalDevelopment #NGO #SocialEnterprise #DevelopmentFinance #Philanthropy #ESG #GirlsEducation #LaurieLee #TBLIRadicalTruth Recorded in 2023. Figures quoted, including the GIIN market sizing, are from that date.

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